Discussion:
Occult group using secret tunnels beneath a British town!
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Alert
2004-10-08 12:13:22 UTC
Permalink
A local newspaper in the UK has revealed an elaborate network of
secret tunnels and passages beneath Hertford, the ancient county town
of Hertfordshire.

Local historians were aware of only one part of the network which was
mapped in a document on public record dated 1898. The newspaper
details numerous tunnels, many of which were blocked during the last
century, and shows photographs of two other entrances. The existence,
extent and purpose of the tunnels were leaked to a journalist by
members of a mysterious secret society in the area said to be related
to the Knights Templar and the Illuminati.

These revelations are restoring Hertfordshire to its rightful place in
Templar legend, and literally put Hertford on the map in the Quest for
the Holy Grail, and there is more to come...


The Insider, "Secret tunnels used by Templars and Illuminati in
Hertford", 8 October 2004.
[ http://www.theinsider.org/mailing/article.asp?id=0620 ]


SOURCES

Hertfordshire Mercury, "The secrets of underground Hertford", pp
16-17, 8 October 2004.
[ http://www.herts-essex-news.co.uk/mercury/news/story.asp?id=159459 ]

BBCi, "Hertfordshire's Templar mystery", 25 November 2003.
[ http://www.bbc.co.uk/legacies/myths_legends/england/beds_herts_bucks/article_1.shtml
]
Alert
2004-10-09 10:08:55 UTC
Permalink
FULL TEXT:-

The secrets of underground Hertford

A SECRET labyrinth of tunnels under Hertford's streets has been
revealed to the Mercury.

Members of the Knights Templar, a secret society which still has
members in the town, have spoken for the first time about the
underground lair used by their forebears almost 1,000 years ago.

Emanating from the dungeons of Hertford Castle and from Fore Street,
the passages run like a warren under the ancient county town and
stretch from Bluecoats to County Hall, according to the group.

Today, many of the entrances to the subterranean passages' have been
bricked up but, according to the modern-day knights, some are still in
use — and may even be booby-trapped.

Too fantastic to be true? Reporter RAYMOND BROWN investigates.

AT a secret location in the town, Tim Acheson declared: "We are now
prepared to reveal a secret we feel the people of Hertford should be
made aware of. There is an extensive labyrinth right under their feet.

"We are talking here about a largely unknown, indeed mostly secret,
ancient underground network that stretches beneath the town's main
street and extends to Fore Street, Market Square, Parliament Square,
Hertford Castle, Church Street, Bluecoats, Priory Street — and in fact
many, many other places.

"It reaches beneath well-known central Hertford locations, including
the tourist office, the Castle, Monsoon, Threshers, the post office,
Bayley Hall, and the council offices, both within the Castle and in
County Hall."

The Mercury was able to verify that one of these passages once
connected Shire Hall, now home to Hertford Magistrates' Court, to the
Salisbury Arms in Fore Street. Mercury photographer Mike Poultney was
there the day it was sealed 25 years ago.

Tim's twin brother Ben said: "The Fore Street section once extended to
a substantial section beneath Bluecoats School, which is still
accessible from certain buildings.

"The Bluecoats section has many secret side-chambers and passages, one
of which leads to chambers beneath the old pub the Dolphin, as well as
a massive section beneath Priory Street.

"The Priory Street section was used by Templar mystics operating
secretly among the Christians of the former long-gone Priory, which
gave Priory Street its name."

And Ben, who lives in Hertford, claims that two secret societies still
meet in the tunnels.

"The ancient subterranean labyrinth beneath Hertford is quite
extensive, although most of it must for now remain secret — and some
chambers are still in use," he said.

"Much of the network was made by the Templars and secret societies
linked to them.

"Some of this work took place long after the Order officially
disbanded in 1307.

"Hertford's labyrinth could in fact provide the final proof that the
Templars disappeared underground — both literally and metaphorically."

With so many of the tunnels bricked up, it is hard to verify all the
Achesons' claims.

But the Mercury, with the help of Hertford Museum, has uncovered an
old map showing a tunnel running from Bailey Hall, which was said to
run to what is now Lussman's restaurant in Fore Street, where another
secret society met. We have also found blocked entrances to tunnels in
Threshers in Fore Street and in the tourist office.

Ben said: "All the sections of the secret Templar labyrinth were once
linked. Here are the parts that I can tell you about.

"Fore Street was once the hub of the only part of the network that you
know about. No 42 Fore Street was once linked to numerous chambers
beneath Fore Street.

"It is still linked, via a passage recently blocked by the previous
owners of 42 Fore Street, reaching to Bailey Hall and beyond.

"This section also branches out to the Old Vicarage, where the
Templar-founded Theosophical Society co-founded a cell of another
secret society, the Knights Templar of Aquarius, via a local mystic
and medium whose ancestors once owned Bailey Hall as well."

According to Ben, the chambers host meetings not only of the Templars,
but of the Illuminati — a shadowy and powerful group said to be bent
on world domination and boasting President George W Bush among its
members.

A recent Sky TV documentary suggested that members of the dark sect
live in the town.

"Some remain in use by the Templars and the Illuminati," said Ben. "In
places you can see where passages led from some of the
still-accessible parts of the labyrinth, linking all of the above
sections together and leading to several still secret tunnels and
chambers.

"We cannot yet reveal details of these. There are also long-forgotten
sections beneath other parts of Hertford, as well as in Royston and
Temple Farm, near Bengeo."

He said there are also branches beneath Church Street leading to
chambers around the dungeons and vaults of Hertford Castle — one leads
all the way to County Hall.

Sections of it are now blocked and partially occupied by a Cold War
nuclear bunker under what is now Elbert Wurlings bar and restaurant.

"These once led to sections beneath and around the crypt of All
Saints' Church, as well as St Andrew Street and beyond," added Ben.

Margaret Harris, of Hertford Museum, said: "I only know for sure about
the Bailey Hall tunnel, which I believe was used by the judges when it
was a law court so that they could get to All Saints' Church nearby.

"That's all I know and I'm quite sceptical about this until I can see
more proof. But they are supposed to be secret."


A brief history of the Knights Templar

The Templars were an international military order who formed during
the crusades in 1118 and grew in power and wealth until their downfall
in 1307, when King Philip arrested all the Templars in France.

Many escaped to England and some settled in Hertford.

Said to be the power behind many of medieval Europe's thrones, they
created the first ever banking system. Clients could take a note to
any Templar church in Europe and withdraw money.

Arguably no less important, the knights also invented the biscuit
during the crusades. They would make a large flat bread and bake it
twice, to prevent it from becoming mouldy.

Some believe that the association of Friday 13th and bad luck dates
from when the Pope rounded up all the Templars and accused them of
heresy, putting many to torture on that day in October 1312.

The Templars are today a registered non-governmental organisation
(NGO) with Special Consultative Status with the United Nations.

Local Templars still meet at Shire Hall in Hertford.


Labyrinth points to Knight moves and the Holdy Grail

THE labyrinth of "booby-trapped" tunnels beneath the streets of the
county town may hold clues in the hunt for the Holy Grail, according
to Hertford members of a secret society.

The warren was used by the Knights Templar, a society of warrior monks
believed to be the keepers of the Grail and the Ark of the Covenant.

At the heart of the maze of tunnels is Hertford Castle. It was there,
in 1309, that four of six Templars from Bengeo were imprisoned
following their arrest by King Edward II, who believed they were
holding a lost treasure.

Ben Acheson, a modern-day Templar, said: "There are treasures of
immense importance underneath Hertford. The people of Hertford should
now be told something of the labyrinth beneath them.

"They have an extensive, ancient and mostly secret Templar heritage
under their feet and it has been there for hundreds of years.

"It is time for Hertford to begin to wake up to the shocking truth.
The labyrinth is important in unravelling the mysteries of the
Templars and the Grail."

Interest in the legendary cup of Jesus, said to have been used at the
Last Supper and by Joseph of Aramithea to catch Christ's blood while
he hung on the cross, has been renewed by Dan Brown's best-selling
novel The Da Vinci Code.

Some believe the grail proves that Jesus married Mary Magdalene and
bore his children, and that their dynasty carries on today.

As the Mercury reported last month, Hertford has been put on the grail
trail due to its historic links with the Knights Templar, who were
believed to own a legendary lost treasure.

It was following a royal order in 1309 that six Templars based at
Temple Dinsley in Bengeo were arrested. Two were sent to the Tower of
London and the remaining four to Hertford Castle.

According to earlier records, dating from 1216, Temple Dinsley was "a
small and poor foundation", but King Edward II believed the Templars
had a massive hoard of gold, silver and precious jewels in a casket,
said to be buried in Bengeo.

The lost treasure, which some believe to be the grail, has never been
recovered.

Mr Acheson said cryptically: "There are some things which we are able
to reveal and some things which we are not.

"This is particularly true in relation to the labyrinth. Most of it
must remain secret."

For security reasons, the Mercury cannot reveal the locations of all
the tunnels as some connect to bank vaults in the town.

According to Mr Acheson, some may even be booby-trapped, as in the
Indiana Jones movies.

He said: "Some of the passages and chambers are highly secret and a
few are still in use. Some parts may also have been rigged to
collapse.

"If you do stumble upon any hidden entrances, passages or chambers
please do steer well clear, if only for your own safety."

A cryptic clue was left at Hertford's tourist office this month with a
picture of a chalice accompanied by a note, which read: "You may wish
to display this to your customers. The reason why will become clear in
due course. If it has not already."

It was signed ‘The Order'.

PICTURE 1. HISTORICAL SNAPSHOT: Taken from an 1898 map advertising the
sale of Bayley Hall, a 'Subterranean passage' is clearly marked within
the grounds. Also visible are Bell Lane, leading north from Bayley
Hall, Church Street, leading north from the top right of the picture,
land to the South of Bailey Hall, which is now the A414, and the Old
Vicarage, now a private residence(s).

PICTURE 2. KNIGHT OF PASSION: Templar Ben Acheson says the labyrinth
of tunnels underneath Hertford is important in unravelling the secrets
of the Templars and the Holy Grail.
[Photo: Templar faces East holding large sword in ritual grip outside
a building at night. Sword held against chest like metallic cross,
Blade points downward, butt by chin, point by shins. White gloved
hands hold sword either side of hand-guard forming the horizontal bar
of the cross; left-hand grips handle, right-hand grips blade.]

PICTURES 3A and 3B. FORGOTTEN BUT NOT GONE: Tunnels under Threshers
off license, left, and Pizza Express, right, both in Fore Street, lend
weight to the idea that Hertford has a true labyrinth of tunnels
beneath the surface.

SOURCE: Hertfordshire Mercury, "The secrets of underground Hertford",
pp 16-17, 8 October 2004.
Archived: [ http://www.herts-essex-news.co.uk/mercury/news/story.asp?id=159459
]


FURTHER READING

BBCi, "Hertfordshire's Templar mystery", 25 November 2003.
[ http://www.bbc.co.uk/legacies/myths_legends/england/beds_herts_bucks/article_1.shtml
]
Legends - England - Beds, Herts and Bucks - The secrets of
underground Hertford
The Order of the Knights Templar was founded by a French Nobleman,
Hugh de Payens and eight companion knights in Jerusalem in 1118 or
1119 AD as official protectors to pilgrims as they journeyed to
Jerusalem. And, whilst this principle of protection was laudable,
historic chronicles have proved pitiless to their memory.
In 1308, the disbandment of the Templars was demanded by the King
of France, Philip the Fair, and a significant part of the demise of
the English Knights Templar in the 13th Century, took place in
Hertfordshire under the orders of King Edward II.
...
There are no remains of the Templars' Preceptory above ground, but
chance finds have been made, including skeletons, a chalice, and the
grave slab pictured here. These were found during works to the east
wing of the house, which seems to have been the location of the
Templar chapel, at some point in the 1880s.
...
A parchment written in a Latin code, derived from the
eight-pointed Templar Cross, exists in the Mark Masons Hall Library in
St James's, London. It surfaced at a bric-a-brac sale in London in
about 1911. It claims to list the Grand Masters through the next five
centuries. But none of the Templar legends are yet to pass the tests
of rigorous scientific and academic proof. But, what we know of the
truth is fascinating enough in itself.
...

Hertfordshire Mercury (UK), "Town may be a base for secret society",
page 2, 17 September 2004.
[ http://www.herts-essex-news.co.uk/mercury/news/story.asp?id=152654 ]
Archived: [ http://www.theinsider.org/mailing/article.asp?id=0591 ]

Hertfordshire Mercury (UK), "Holy Grail: Is it here?", page 3, 10
September 2004.
[ http://www.herts-essex-news.co.uk/mercury/news/story.asp?id=150387 ]
Archived: [ http://www.theinsider.org/mailing/article.asp?id=0582 ]


--
The Insider
http://www.theinsider.org
Jymn
2004-10-21 13:01:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alert
A local newspaper in the UK has revealed an elaborate network
of
secret tunnels and passages beneath Hertford, the ancient
county town
of Hertfordshire.
Hardly unusual for any town to have a network of tunnels. The victorians had
a habit of building them so the posh parts of town could have coal
deliveries and not have the deliveries cluttering their streets, as well as
for diverting streams and as additional storm drains.
Not really secret, just largely forgotten.

Jymn
Alert
2004-10-21 19:44:19 UTC
Permalink
Thanks, your comments are both interesting and pertenant, but your
suggested explanations do not apply to these particular structures.
For example, one of them is several miles in length. Also, the
entrances are invariably indoors.
Post by Jymn
Post by Alert
A local newspaper in the UK has revealed an elaborate network of
secret tunnels and passages beneath Hertford, the ancient
county town
of Hertfordshire.
Hardly unusual for any town to have a network of tunnels. The victorians had
a habit of building them so the posh parts of town could have coal
deliveries and not have the deliveries cluttering their streets, as well as
for diverting streams and as additional storm drains.
Not really secret, just largely forgotten.
Jymn
Jymn
2004-10-25 19:42:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alert
Thanks, your comments are both interesting and pertenant, but
your
suggested explanations do not apply to these particular
structures.
For example, one of them is several miles in length. Also, the
entrances are invariably indoors.
I've walked one that was about 4 and a half miles long, the entrance I used
was from what is now a museum but was a grand house the exit I used is now a
pub but there was more tunnel to go in that direction, we stuck to our plans
and went to the pub. There were several branches from the main tunnel, most
of which I was informed lead to the basements of big houses.

Jymn
Alert
2004-10-21 19:44:47 UTC
Permalink
We have obtained scans of the original newspaper articles, including
maps and photos. These include a picture of a modern-day Knights
Templar, photographed working a ritual with a sword outside the
Temple, in secret location late at night. He's wearing suit, tie and
white gloves, and holding a sword against his chest in a ritual grip
while facing the rising sun.

Photos and other materials are available and can be sent by email on
request via:

http://www.theinsider.org/feedback/

Weird, but interesting!
Post by Alert
A local newspaper in the UK has revealed an elaborate network of
secret tunnels and passages beneath Hertford, the ancient county town
of Hertfordshire.
Local historians were aware of only one part of the network which was
mapped in a document on public record dated 1898. The newspaper
details numerous tunnels, many of which were blocked during the last
century, and shows photographs of two other entrances. The existence,
extent and purpose of the tunnels were leaked to a journalist by
members of a mysterious secret society in the area said to be related
to the Knights Templar and the Illuminati.
These revelations are restoring Hertfordshire to its rightful place in
Templar legend, and literally put Hertford on the map in the Quest for
the Holy Grail, and there is more to come...
The Insider, "Secret tunnels used by Templars and Illuminati in
Hertford", 8 October 2004.
[ http://www.theinsider.org/mailing/article.asp?id=0620 ]
SOURCES
Hertfordshire Mercury, "The secrets of underground Hertford", pp
16-17, 8 October 2004.
[ http://www.herts-essex-news.co.uk/mercury/news/story.asp?id=159459 ]
BBCi, "Hertfordshire's Templar mystery", 25 November 2003.
[ http://www.bbc.co.uk/legacies/myths_legends/england/beds_herts_bucks/article_1.shtml
]
Jani
2004-10-21 22:35:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alert
We have obtained scans of the original newspaper articles, including
maps and photos. These include a picture of a modern-day Knights
Templar, photographed working a ritual with a sword outside the
Temple, in secret location late at night. He's wearing suit, tie and
white gloves, and holding a sword against his chest in a ritual grip
while facing the rising sun.
I hate to break this to you, but the sun doesn't rise late at night.

You really *should* get out more :)

Jani
Alert
2004-10-22 10:30:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jani
Post by Alert
We have obtained scans of the original newspaper articles, including
maps and photos. These include a picture of a modern-day Knights
Templar, photographed working a ritual with a sword outside the
Temple, in secret location late at night. He's wearing suit, tie and
white gloves, and holding a sword against his chest in a ritual grip
while facing the rising sun.
I hate to break this to you, but the sun doesn't rise late at night.
You really *should* get out more :)
Jani
I hate to break it to you, but the hour before dawn is still
technically night. Furthermore, and more important than the sunrise,
is the helical rising of the morning star which appears on the horizon
in the same place as the sun.
Jani
2004-10-22 11:58:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alert
Post by Jani
Post by Alert
We have obtained scans of the original newspaper articles, including
maps and photos. These include a picture of a modern-day Knights
Templar, photographed working a ritual with a sword outside the
Temple, in secret location late at night. He's wearing suit, tie and
white gloves, and holding a sword against his chest in a ritual grip
while facing the rising sun.
I hate to break this to you, but the sun doesn't rise late at night.
You really *should* get out more :)
Jani
I hate to break it to you, but the hour before dawn is still
technically night.
So it's late at night, it's the hour before dawn, and it's sunrise. OK, let
me guess. Hertford's translocated to Iceland?

Jani
Alert
2004-10-23 20:29:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jani
Post by Alert
Post by Jani
Post by Alert
We have obtained scans of the original newspaper articles, including
maps and photos. These include a picture of a modern-day Knights
Templar, photographed working a ritual with a sword outside the
Temple, in secret location late at night. He's wearing suit, tie and
white gloves, and holding a sword against his chest in a ritual grip
while facing the rising sun.
I hate to break this to you, but the sun doesn't rise late at night.
You really *should* get out more :)
Jani
I hate to break it to you, but the hour before dawn is still
technically night.
So it's late at night, it's the hour before dawn, and it's sunrise. OK, let
me guess. Hertford's translocated to Iceland?
Jani
What are you talking about? The picture was taken before dawn. That
part of the 24 hour cycle daily is called "night" wherever you are.
What do you call it?
Jani
2004-10-23 21:20:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alert
Post by Jani
Post by Alert
Post by Jani
Post by Alert
We have obtained scans of the original newspaper articles, including
maps and photos. These include a picture of a modern-day Knights
Templar, photographed working a ritual with a sword outside the
Temple, in secret location late at night. He's wearing suit, tie and
white gloves, and holding a sword against his chest in a ritual grip
while facing the rising sun.
I hate to break this to you, but the sun doesn't rise late at night.
You really *should* get out more :)
Jani
I hate to break it to you, but the hour before dawn is still
technically night.
So it's late at night, it's the hour before dawn, and it's sunrise. OK, let
me guess. Hertford's translocated to Iceland?
Jani
What are you talking about? The picture was taken before dawn. That
part of the 24 hour cycle daily is called "night" wherever you are.
What do you call it?
Um, what part of "late at night", "the rising sun" and "the hour before
dawn" all being simultaneous did you not understand? If this chap's facing
the rising sun, it's not late at night, and nor is it the hour before dawn.
It's *sunrise*, which doesn't happen late at night, nor does it happen
"before dawn" because sunrise *is* dawn.

Jani
Daniel Cohen
2004-10-24 17:08:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jani
Um, what part of "late at night", "the rising sun" and "the hour before
dawn" all being simultaneous did you not understand? If this chap's facing
the rising sun, it's not late at night,and nor is it the hour before dawn.
Arguable. I think 3 a.m. is always late at night, and it could also be
the hour before dawn. Agreed, not in Hertford, but I am hoping to get to
the Orkneys around summer solstice.
Post by Jani
It's *sunrise*, which doesn't happen late at night, nor does it happen
"before dawn" because sunrise *is* dawn.
The glow well before the sun is actually visible is perhaps "before
dawn" - though perhaps this, rather than visibility of the sun, is dawn.
And facing that could, though not entirely acurrately, be described as
facing the rising sun.
--
Send e-mail to the Reply-To address;
mail to the From address is never read
platypus
2004-10-22 19:16:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alert
I hate to break it to you, but the hour before dawn is still
technically night. Furthermore, and more important than the sunrise,
is the helical rising of the morning star which appears on the horizon
in the same place as the sun.
...except when it's doing duty as the evening star.
--
Platypus

A man barely alive.
Mad Witch
2004-10-22 22:27:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by platypus
Post by Alert
I hate to break it to you, but the hour before dawn is still
technically night. Furthermore, and more important than the sunrise,
is the helical rising of the morning star which appears on the horizon
in the same place as the sun.
...except when it's doing duty as the evening star.
Or not being a star at all because it's the planet Venus.

The hour before dawn tends to consist of False Dawn and twilight. It's
morning, not night, by most standards. Methinks someone needs to stay up on
a clear night, or get up very early and experience the hour before dawn.
Dawn will be 7:24 AM here tomorrow. Lat 55.52 long 4.17 (give or take about
100 miles)

X
MW
Alert
2004-10-23 20:31:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mad Witch
Post by platypus
Post by Alert
I hate to break it to you, but the hour before dawn is still
technically night. Furthermore, and more important than the sunrise,
is the helical rising of the morning star which appears on the horizon
in the same place as the sun.
...except when it's doing duty as the evening star.
Or not being a star at all because it's the planet Venus.
True, it is only a star by in so far as that is its traditional name.
Post by Mad Witch
The hour before dawn tends to consist of False Dawn and twilight. It's
morning, not night, by most standards. Methinks someone needs to stay up on
a clear night, or get up very early and experience the hour before dawn.
Dawn will be 7:24 AM here tomorrow. Lat 55.52 long 4.17 (give or take about
100 miles)
X
MW
Jani
2004-10-23 21:22:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alert
Post by Mad Witch
Post by platypus
Post by Alert
I hate to break it to you, but the hour before dawn is still
technically night. Furthermore, and more important than the sunrise,
is the helical rising of the morning star which appears on the horizon
in the same place as the sun.
...except when it's doing duty as the evening star.
Or not being a star at all because it's the planet Venus.
True, it is only a star by in so far as that is its traditional name.
Like "late at night" is apparently the traditional name for sunrise? :)

Jani
Mad Witch
2004-10-24 11:39:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jani
Post by Alert
Post by Mad Witch
Post by platypus
Post by Alert
I hate to break it to you, but the hour before dawn is still
technically night. Furthermore, and more important than the
sunrise, is the helical rising of the morning star which appears
on the horizon in the same place as the sun.
...except when it's doing duty as the evening star.
Or not being a star at all because it's the planet Venus.
True, it is only a star by in so far as that is its traditional name.
Like "late at night" is apparently the traditional name for sunrise? :)
It's all part of the conspiracy to prove that there is an illuminati
conspiracy AFAICS ;)

X
MW
M.H.
2004-10-24 14:12:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mad Witch
Post by Jani
Post by Alert
Post by Mad Witch
Post by platypus
Post by Alert
I hate to break it to you, but the hour before dawn is still
technically night. Furthermore, and more important than the
sunrise, is the helical rising of the morning star which appears
on the horizon in the same place as the sun.
...except when it's doing duty as the evening star.
Or not being a star at all because it's the planet Venus.
True, it is only a star by in so far as that is its traditional name.
Like "late at night" is apparently the traditional name for sunrise? :)
It's all part of the conspiracy to prove that there is an illuminati
conspiracy AFAICS ;)
X
MW
or maybe we are conspiring to disprove the conspiracy that there is a
conspiracy to prove the illuminati conspiracy.
Margaret
Jackdaw
2004-10-24 18:55:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by M.H.
Post by Mad Witch
Post by Jani
Post by Alert
Post by Mad Witch
Post by platypus
Post by Alert
I hate to break it to you, but the hour before dawn is still
technically night. Furthermore, and more important than the
sunrise, is the helical rising of the morning star which appears
on the horizon in the same place as the sun.
...except when it's doing duty as the evening star.
Or not being a star at all because it's the planet Venus.
True, it is only a star by in so far as that is its traditional name.
Like "late at night" is apparently the traditional name for sunrise? :)
It's all part of the conspiracy to prove that there is an illuminati
conspiracy AFAICS ;)
X
MW
or maybe we are conspiring to disprove the conspiracy that there is a
conspiracy to prove the illuminati conspiracy.
Reads three times, takes Aspirin and goes to bed early.
Please don't do that to my poor brain.
--
Jackdaw, collector of facts, trivia and bright twinkly things.
Folio--- http://www.jackdaw-crafts.co.uk
Mad Witch
2004-10-24 20:09:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by M.H.
Post by Mad Witch
Post by Jani
Post by Alert
Post by Mad Witch
Post by platypus
Post by Alert
I hate to break it to you, but the hour before dawn is still
technically night. Furthermore, and more important than the
sunrise, is the helical rising of the morning star which appears
on the horizon in the same place as the sun.
...except when it's doing duty as the evening star.
Or not being a star at all because it's the planet Venus.
True, it is only a star by in so far as that is its traditional name.
Like "late at night" is apparently the traditional name for sunrise? :)
It's all part of the conspiracy to prove that there is an illuminati
conspiracy AFAICS ;)
X
MW
or maybe we are conspiring to disprove the conspiracy that there is a
conspiracy to prove the illuminati conspiracy.
Or we could be conspiring with the illuninati conspiracy to prove there is
no conspiracy so the conspiracy can carry on without being discovered?

:P

X
MW
--
Just because I'm paranoid it doesn't mean they're not out to get me.
janet
2004-10-24 20:13:33 UTC
Permalink
Mad Witch wrote:
<snipped by them as KNOW>


Nothing to see here at all, nothing at all, move along there, let's
be having you, off you go....
--
janet
texestentialist
http://www.karlsforums.com/forums/index.php
Mad Witch
2004-10-24 20:23:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by janet
<snipped by them as KNOW>
Nothing to see here at all, nothing at all, move along there, let's
be having you, off you go....
Did you see that typo? ROTFL. ilu*n*inati?

I couldn't have put it better if I'd tried.

X
MW
Trin
2004-10-24 20:51:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jani
Like "late at night" is apparently the traditional name for sunrise? :)
Surely it's dependant upon which way you're approaching from, timewise? :)
Rhiannon S
2004-10-24 21:39:24 UTC
Permalink
Subject: Re: Occult group using secret tunnels beneath a British town!
Date: 24/10/2004 21:51 GMT Daylight Time
Post by Jani
Like "late at night" is apparently the traditional name for sunrise? :)
Surely it's dependant upon which way you're approaching from, timewise? :)
Well, I call 10pm early evening, 1am is late evening, night for me starts
around 3-4am and an early morning is sometime 1pm.
--
Rhiannon
http://www.livejournal.com/users/rhiannon_s/
"The trick is to commit crimes so confusing that police feel too stupid to even
write a crime report about them."
Aubrey on remaining at liberty
www.somethingpositive.net
Perplexed Seal
2004-10-23 16:14:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jani
Post by Alert
We have obtained scans of the original newspaper articles, including
maps and photos. These include a picture of a modern-day Knights
Templar, photographed working a ritual with a sword outside the
Temple, in secret location late at night. He's wearing suit, tie and
white gloves, and holding a sword against his chest in a ritual grip
while facing the rising sun.
I hate to break this to you, but the sun doesn't rise late at night.
You really *should* get out more :)
Whilst I am not in the KT there are a couple of linguistic tangles in the
other rituals which lead to things like this.

Mind you, how late at night do you need to go until it's actually very early
in the morning ;)

Mind you, from what I know of the KT ritual, I don't recognise the
description given, but then I'm not a reporter :)

Alistair
Jani
2004-10-23 16:18:42 UTC
Permalink
[]
Post by Perplexed Seal
Post by Jani
I hate to break this to you, but the sun doesn't rise late at night.
You really *should* get out more :)
Whilst I am not in the KT there are a couple of linguistic tangles in the
other rituals which lead to things like this.
Mind you, how late at night do you need to go until it's actually very
early in the morning ;)
Well, I think once you can "face the rising sun" you're pretty sure it's no
longer "late at night" :)
Post by Perplexed Seal
Mind you, from what I know of the KT ritual, I don't recognise the
description given, but then I'm not a reporter :)
I liked the white suit. Very Randall and Hopkirk, that was.

Jani
Perplexed Seal
2004-10-23 17:02:46 UTC
Permalink
"Jani"
"Perplexed Seal"
Post by Perplexed Seal
Mind you, from what I know of the KT ritual, I don't recognise the
description given, but then I'm not a reporter :)
I liked the white suit. Very Randall and Hopkirk, that was.
Well most KT that I know tend to wear morning suit with the short jacket.

And now that I'm back down to a 32 inch waist I'm kind of hopeful of getting
into mine in the near future :)

Alistair
Jani
2004-10-23 19:43:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Perplexed Seal
"Jani"
"Perplexed Seal"
Post by Perplexed Seal
Mind you, from what I know of the KT ritual, I don't recognise the
description given, but then I'm not a reporter :)
I liked the white suit. Very Randall and Hopkirk, that was.
Well most KT that I know tend to wear morning suit with the short jacket.
And now that I'm back down to a 32 inch waist I'm kind of hopeful of
getting into mine in the near future :)
Do we get pictures? :)

Jani
(who prefers kilts but has no great objection to morning suits)
Perplexed Seal
2004-10-23 20:57:29 UTC
Permalink
"Jani" .
"Perplexed Seal"
Post by Perplexed Seal
"Jani"
"Perplexed Seal"
Post by Perplexed Seal
Mind you, from what I know of the KT ritual, I don't recognise the
description given, but then I'm not a reporter :)
I liked the white suit. Very Randall and Hopkirk, that was.
Well most KT that I know tend to wear morning suit with the short jacket.
And now that I'm back down to a 32 inch waist I'm kind of hopeful of
getting into mine in the near future :)
Do we get pictures? :)
I might just be able to get into the kilt, which I think was measured up for
a 32 waist :)

Meaningless trivia, I was installed in my kilt rather than morning suit :)

Alistair
Jani
2004-10-23 21:28:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Perplexed Seal
"Jani" .
"Perplexed Seal"
Post by Perplexed Seal
"Jani"
"Perplexed Seal"
Post by Perplexed Seal
Mind you, from what I know of the KT ritual, I don't recognise the
description given, but then I'm not a reporter :)
I liked the white suit. Very Randall and Hopkirk, that was.
Well most KT that I know tend to wear morning suit with the short jacket.
And now that I'm back down to a 32 inch waist I'm kind of hopeful of
getting into mine in the near future :)
Do we get pictures? :)
I might just be able to get into the kilt, which I think was measured up
for a 32 waist :)
Meaningless trivia, I was installed in my kilt rather than morning suit :)
Well, don't mention it where that loony troll from alt.freemasonry can hear
you, he'll be off on a rant about transvestite masons ;)

Jani
Perplexed Seal
2004-10-23 22:27:59 UTC
Permalink
"Jani"
Post by Jani
Well, don't mention it where that loony troll from alt.freemasonry can
hear you, he'll be off on a rant about transvestite masons ;)
Oh he's been in sof as well.

Alistair
Jani
2004-10-24 07:09:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Perplexed Seal
"Jani"
Post by Jani
Well, don't mention it where that loony troll from alt.freemasonry can
hear you, he'll be off on a rant about transvestite masons ;)
Oh he's been in sof as well.
I made the mistake of replying to him a couple of times from ACC. Actually
it wasn't all bad, I had some nice exchanges with a few of the American
masons as a result :)

Jani
Perplexed Seal
2004-10-24 09:32:36 UTC
Permalink
"Jani"
Post by Jani
I made the mistake of replying to him a couple of times from ACC. Actually
it wasn't all bad, I had some nice exchanges with a few of the American
masons as a result :)
heh

OTW masonry, enlightening was it?

Alistair
Jani
2004-10-24 09:37:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Perplexed Seal
"Jani"
Post by Jani
I made the mistake of replying to him a couple of times from ACC.
Actually it wasn't all bad, I had some nice exchanges with a few of the
American masons as a result :)
heh
OTW masonry, enlightening was it?
Are they OTW? Well, at least they were polite ;)

Jani
Perplexed Seal
2004-10-24 10:09:47 UTC
Permalink
"Jani"
"Perplexed Seal"
Post by Perplexed Seal
"Jani"
Post by Jani
I made the mistake of replying to him a couple of times from ACC.
Actually it wasn't all bad, I had some nice exchanges with a few of the
American masons as a result :)
heh
OTW masonry, enlightening was it?
Are they OTW? Well, at least they were polite ;)
Oh they can be, very much :)

Most amusing as a member of the oldest historically identifiable lodge (16th
C with circumstancial evidence back to the 12th).

Alistair
Mad Witch
2004-10-24 20:19:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Perplexed Seal
"Jani"
"Perplexed Seal"
Post by Perplexed Seal
"Jani"
Post by Jani
I made the mistake of replying to him a couple of times from ACC.
Actually it wasn't all bad, I had some nice exchanges with a few of
the American masons as a result :)
heh
OTW masonry, enlightening was it?
Are they OTW? Well, at least they were polite ;)
Oh they can be, very much :)
Most amusing as a member of the oldest historically identifiable lodge
(16th C with circumstancial evidence back to the 12th).
Ug. I'll have to get out more. The idea of masonry being off the wall just
puts me straight into a diy prog with tommy walsh, and mixing that with
kilts just isn't nice.

<scrubs what's left of brain with carbolic>

X
MW
Perplexed Seal
2004-10-24 21:16:04 UTC
Permalink
"Mad Witch"
Post by Mad Witch
Ug. I'll have to get out more. The idea of masonry being off the wall just
puts me straight into a diy prog with tommy walsh, and mixing that with
kilts just isn't nice.
One True Way!

Alistair
PM
Mad Witch
2004-10-25 10:11:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Perplexed Seal
"Mad Witch"
Post by Mad Witch
Ug. I'll have to get out more. The idea of masonry being off the wall
just puts me straight into a diy prog with tommy walsh, and mixing
that with kilts just isn't nice.
One True Way!
I know, but the brain just doesn't co-operate ;-) It's reading *masonry*
that does it, I'm seeing brickwork not Masons. <shrugs> anyone want my
braincell back, I'm not working it hard enough obviously.

X
MW
Corvus
2004-10-23 00:15:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alert
A local newspaper in the UK has revealed an elaborate network of
secret tunnels and passages beneath Hertford, the ancient county town
of Hertfordshire.
I can certainly vouch for Hertfordshire being a major stronghold area of
the Knights Templar. Baldock basically didn't exist before they founded
it as a useful turnpike on an intersection of trade routes. Royston's
Cave predates the Templars by a thousand years or so, but was used by
them as a handy hiding place. There are many other examples through the
County, as well as elsewhere, of course. I wouldn't be at all surprised
to hear that there was a Templar tunnel complex under Hertford, although
I'd be equally surprised if they hadn't been considerably extended since
the Templars' time, with propellor-head Templar fans then giving them
the credit for prior art.

"Occult group"? Do us a favour. The Templars got fairly heretical, by
contemporary account, but they're only "Occult" in that they were pretty
effectively hidden from view by the Papal purges that resulted in the
liquidation of the Order, the execution of many of them (culminating in
the death of Jacques de Molay, burnt on the 18th May 1314), and the
transfer of their property to the Knights Hospitaller of St John.

But, Illuminati? Someone's been reading way too much Robert Anton Wilson
(et al), and smoking some *really* dodgy stuff.

If you're looking for a conspiracy underwriting Geo. W. Bush and his
cronies, look no further than the Project for the New American Century
(http://www.newamericancentury.org/). Only problem is, they're about as
unIlluminated as you're ever likely to get. I note that Donald Rumsfeld,
Jeb Bush, Paul Wolfowitz, Dan Quayle and Dick Cheney (amongst other
prominent neocons in, or connected to, GWB's administration) have
quietly removed themselves from the visible membership these days,
although earlier versions of the site named them as members, and they
all appear as signatories on some of the open letters still published.
I've no doubt that all or most are still members.

Read the site. It's seriously scary.

Corvus
--
EMAIL SPAM BLOCK! Replace 'deadspam' with 'highlygreen' to reply in email.
(See http://www.deadspam.com/)
Jani
2004-10-23 11:50:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Corvus
If you're looking for a conspiracy underwriting Geo. W. Bush and his
cronies, look no further than the Project for the New American Century
(http://www.newamericancentury.org/).
Indeed. I hadn't looked at that for a while. A quote picked at random ...

"... the preservation of a decent world order depends chiefly on the
exercise of American leadership."

Eeep.

Jani
M.H.
2004-10-23 12:14:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jani
Post by Corvus
If you're looking for a conspiracy underwriting Geo. W. Bush and his
cronies, look no further than the Project for the New American Century
(http://www.newamericancentury.org/).
Indeed. I hadn't looked at that for a while. A quote picked at random ...
"... the preservation of a decent world order depends chiefly on the
exercise of American leadership."
Eeep.
Jani
There was a TV programme earlier this week, I think it was, which explored
the way in which this mindset was fostered by some of the people mentioned
on that list, and some of those whose names have been taken off, and why.
It was very interesting and very scary.
Margaret
Jani
2004-10-23 12:45:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by M.H.
Post by Jani
Post by Corvus
If you're looking for a conspiracy underwriting Geo. W. Bush and his
cronies, look no further than the Project for the New American Century
(http://www.newamericancentury.org/).
Indeed. I hadn't looked at that for a while. A quote picked at random ...
"... the preservation of a decent world order depends chiefly on the
exercise of American leadership."
Eeep.
Jani
There was a TV programme earlier this week, I think it was, which explored
the way in which this mindset was fostered by some of the people mentioned
on that list, and some of those whose names have been taken off, and why.
It was very interesting and very scary.
I'm rather glad I didn't see that ...

Jani
Jackdaw
2004-10-23 12:46:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jani
Post by Corvus
If you're looking for a conspiracy underwriting Geo. W. Bush and his
cronies, look no further than the Project for the New American Century
(http://www.newamericancentury.org/).
Indeed. I hadn't looked at that for a while. A quote picked at random ...
"... the preservation of a decent world order depends chiefly on the
exercise of American leadership."
Eeep.
Jani
With you there Jani, that is scary, and the thing is, unlike a poor horror
film......
It's real, out there over the pond.
Pax Americana...
no comment.
--
Jackdaw, collector of facts, trivia and bright twinkly things.
Folio--- http://www.jackdaw-crafts.co.uk
Jani
2004-10-23 14:08:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jackdaw
Post by Jani
Post by Corvus
If you're looking for a conspiracy underwriting Geo. W. Bush and his
cronies, look no further than the Project for the New American Century
(http://www.newamericancentury.org/).
Indeed. I hadn't looked at that for a while. A quote picked at random ...
"... the preservation of a decent world order depends chiefly on the
exercise of American leadership."
Eeep.
Jani
With you there Jani, that is scary, and the thing is, unlike a poor horror
film......
It's real, out there over the pond.
I don't suppose we were much better, when the British Empire was flattening
everything in its path. I don't see that this world domination thing has
made the average American any happier, though.

Jani
(no, I'm not going to define "average American". I'll just take Janet's
thwacking me as read ;)
Alert
2004-10-23 20:38:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jani
Post by Corvus
If you're looking for a conspiracy underwriting Geo. W. Bush and his
cronies, look no further than the Project for the New American Century
(http://www.newamericancentury.org/).
Indeed. I hadn't looked at that for a while. A quote picked at random ...
"... the preservation of a decent world order depends chiefly on the
exercise of American leadership."
PNAC have published many statements that may be of concern,
particularly since they have been writing policy for the American
regime since the Cold War and have never been more influential than
they are today.

Not least of their statements about the formation of a New World Order
is this remarkable prediction, made in September 2000, exactly one
year before 9/11:

"Further, the process of transformation,
even if it brings revolutionary change, is
likely to be a long one, absent some
catastrophic and catalyzing event – like a
new Pearl Harbor."

http://www.theinsider.org/mailing/article.asp?id=0502
Romauld
2004-10-25 13:34:28 UTC
Permalink
Recently, a script from Jani arrived, in which they said:

: Indeed. I hadn't looked at that for a while. A quote picked at random ...
:
: "... the preservation of a decent world order depends chiefly on the
: exercise of American leadership."
:
: Eeep.

In 1998 they [1] wrote a letter to President Clinton, which coined the
term 'regime change', and which advocated invading Iraq, securing it's
oil, and founding a permanent military presence in the Gulf [2].

In January 2004 they wrote a letter to President Bush, entitled
'Regime Change for Iran'

That's the one that scares me...

~R

[1] Where 'they' include Jeb Bush (GWB's brother), Dick Cheney (GWB's VP),
Don Rumsfeld (GWB's Defence minister, who organised the Iraq invasion)
and Paul Wolfowitz (GWB's Deputy DM, who was the man who on Sept. 12
2001 took Dick Clarke aside and said 'Find out how Iraq was linked to
this')

[2] Yes, the administration has begun work on building 14 permanent
US army and air-force bases in Iraqi territory. Yes, they are
still telling the US populace that they are trying to get out of
Iraq as soon as possible. No, I don't believe them.
--
Romauld - romauld at necrotheque dot dcu

"Imagination: the one effective weapon in the war against reality."
- http://www.geocities.com/vasudevanvrv/deftdef2.htm
Wood Avens
2004-10-23 16:02:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Corvus
If you're looking for a conspiracy underwriting Geo. W. Bush and his
cronies, look no further than the Project for the New American Century
(http://www.newamericancentury.org/). Only problem is, they're about as
unIlluminated as you're ever likely to get. I note that Donald Rumsfeld,
Jeb Bush, Paul Wolfowitz, Dan Quayle and Dick Cheney (amongst other
prominent neocons in, or connected to, GWB's administration) have
quietly removed themselves from the visible membership these days,
although earlier versions of the site named them as members, and they
all appear as signatories on some of the open letters still published.
I've no doubt that all or most are still members.
Read the site. It's seriously scary.
It also contained one of the most Freudian spelling-mistakes I've ever
seen, the PNAC's avowed aim to "reign in terror". Couldn't find the
article when I checked just now, cos they've re-organised the site,
but I expect it's still there.
--
Wood Avens

spamtrap: remove the first two letters after the @
Alert
2004-10-23 20:34:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Corvus
Post by Alert
A local newspaper in the UK has revealed an elaborate network of
secret tunnels and passages beneath Hertford, the ancient county town
of Hertfordshire.
I can certainly vouch for Hertfordshire being a major stronghold area of
the Knights Templar. Baldock basically didn't exist before they founded
it as a useful turnpike on an intersection of trade routes. Royston's
Cave predates the Templars by a thousand years or so, but was used by
them as a handy hiding place. There are many other examples through the
County, as well as elsewhere, of course. I wouldn't be at all surprised
to hear that there was a Templar tunnel complex under Hertford, although
I'd be equally surprised if they hadn't been considerably extended since
the Templars' time, with propellor-head Templar fans then giving them
the credit for prior art.
"Occult group"? Do us a favour. The Templars got fairly heretical, by
contemporary account, but they're only "Occult" in that they were pretty
effectively hidden from view by the Papal purges that resulted in the
Yes, so by definition they are occult.
Post by Corvus
liquidation of the Order, the execution of many of them (culminating in
the death of Jacques de Molay, burnt on the 18th May 1314), and the
transfer of their property to the Knights Hospitaller of St John.
But, Illuminati? Someone's been reading way too much Robert Anton Wilson
(et al), and smoking some *really* dodgy stuff.
Are you suggesting that the Illuminati never existed?? No, I thought
not.
Post by Corvus
If you're looking for a conspiracy underwriting Geo. W. Bush and his
cronies, look no further than the Project for the New American Century
(http://www.newamericancentury.org/). Only problem is, they're about as
unIlluminated as you're ever likely to get. I note that Donald Rumsfeld,
Jeb Bush, Paul Wolfowitz, Dan Quayle and Dick Cheney (amongst other
prominent neocons in, or connected to, GWB's administration) have
quietly removed themselves from the visible membership these days,
although earlier versions of the site named them as members, and they
all appear as signatories on some of the open letters still published.
I've no doubt that all or most are still members.
Read the site. It's seriously scary.
I've read ever PNAC document ever published, and wrote some of the
articles on that topic on this website:

http://www.theinsider.org
Corvus
2004-10-23 21:32:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alert
Post by Corvus
"Occult group"? Do us a favour. The Templars got fairly heretical, by
contemporary account, but they're only "Occult" in that they were pretty
effectively hidden from view by the Papal purges that resulted in the
Yes, so by definition they are occult.
And by the same definition, so are sewer rats, bats, and the mains water
stop-cock outside my house.

Not the more commonly accepted meaning of the word, in this context
(e.g. "Of, relating to, or dealing with supernatural influences,
agencies, or phenomena"), which was what I was addressing.
Post by Alert
Post by Corvus
But, Illuminati? Someone's been reading way too much Robert Anton Wilson
(et al), and smoking some *really* dodgy stuff.
Are you suggesting that the Illuminati never existed?? No, I thought
not.
Weishaupt's Bavarian Illuminati were, strangely enough, Bavarian. The
extension of that eighteenth-century organisation to some kind of
modern-day pan-global underground locus of political control was, as far
as can be ascertained, a paranoid fiction cooked up by the American
Religious Right in the mid-Sixties, following a distinctly
propellor-headed 1921 article by Nesta Webster. I've seen no convincing
evidence of their actual existence as a continuing organisation with the
power of, say, the Bilderburgers or PNAC.
Post by Alert
I've read ever PNAC document ever published, and wrote some of the
In which we see, on the front page, the priceless quote:

We document the best evidence available from the most credible
sources, such as national newspapers and official government
websites.

Enough said.

Meanwhile, did you actually have anything of significant to contribute
to the Pagan community, or did you just come here to spam us?

Corvus
--
EMAIL SPAM BLOCK! Replace 'deadspam' with 'highlygreen' to reply in email.
(See http://www.deadspam.com/)
Alert
2004-10-25 10:50:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Corvus
Post by Alert
Post by Corvus
"Occult group"? Do us a favour. The Templars got fairly heretical, by
contemporary account, but they're only "Occult" in that they were pretty
effectively hidden from view by the Papal purges that resulted in the
Yes, so by definition they are occult.
And by the same definition, so are sewer rats, bats, and the mains water
stop-cock outside my house.
Not the more commonly accepted meaning of the word, in this context
(e.g. "Of, relating to, or dealing with supernatural influences,
agencies, or phenomena"), which was what I was addressing.
Your definition of "occult" would also apply e.g. to the miracles of
Jesus or Moses and the stury thereof.
Post by Corvus
Post by Alert
Post by Corvus
But, Illuminati? Someone's been reading way too much Robert Anton Wilson
(et al), and smoking some *really* dodgy stuff.
Are you suggesting that the Illuminati never existed?? No, I thought
not.
Weishaupt's Bavarian Illuminati were, strangely enough, Bavarian. The
extension of that eighteenth-century organisation to some kind of
modern-day pan-global underground locus of political control was, as far
as can be ascertained, a paranoid fiction cooked up by the American
Religious Right in the mid-Sixties, following a distinctly
propellor-headed 1921 article by Nesta Webster. I've seen no convincing
evidence of their actual existence as a continuing organisation with the
power of, say, the Bilderburgers or PNAC.
If you aren't aware of the theoretical connection, you simply haven't
done the homework.
Post by Corvus
Post by Alert
I've read ever PNAC document ever published, and wrote some of the
We document the best evidence available from the most credible
sources, such as national newspapers and official government
websites.
Enough said.
Meanwhile, did you actually have anything of significant to contribute
to the Pagan community, or did you just come here to spam us?
Corvus
Check the definition of Spam (and note the capital "S").
Romauld
2004-10-25 13:38:18 UTC
Permalink
Recently, a script from Alert arrived, in which they said:

: Your definition of "occult" would also apply e.g. to the miracles of
: Jesus or Moses and the stury thereof.

*The* definition of 'Occult' is 'hidden from view'. Common usage in
English, however, has acquired nuances which convey 'deliberately
secret', 'to do with magic' and 'scary and dangerous'.

: Check the definition of Spam (and note the capital "S").

Unsolicited Commercial / Bulk Email. Neither of which you have done.

However:

1) The term was originally coined for a Usenet incident, and the terms
UCE and UBE came later; if one goes by original usage, no email can be
considered Spam.

2) Common usage, again, of the term includes 'Unsolicted electronic
communication'. Which is what Corvus meant.

~R
--
Romauld - romauld at necrotheque dot dcu

"Imagination: the one effective weapon in the war against reality."
- http://www.geocities.com/vasudevanvrv/deftdef2.htm
Corvus
2004-10-25 19:46:37 UTC
Permalink
[snip]
Whatever.

Ever considered moving to the UK and converting to Paganism?

Do drop in when you do so.

Corvus
--
EMAIL SPAM BLOCK! Replace 'deadspam' with 'highlygreen' to reply in email.
(See http://www.deadspam.com/)
Alert
2004-10-26 11:24:59 UTC
Permalink
I am already in the UK, in London even as I write, and true Paganism
is not something to which one converts. It is not a brand of TV, or
Born Again Christianity. It is to become one with the natural world,
it is a philosophy, it is a way of life.

Blessed Be.

www.theinsider.org
Post by Corvus
[snip]
Whatever.
Ever considered moving to the UK and converting to Paganism?
Do drop in when you do so.
Corvus
Corvus
2004-10-26 23:24:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alert
I am already in the UK, in London even as I write, and true Paganism
is not something to which one converts. It is not a brand of TV, or
Born Again Christianity. It is to become one with the natural world,
it is a philosophy, it is a way of life.
Blessed Be.
Thanks for the RE lesson. Being a regular here, I wouldn't have known
that. Interestingly, I note that you don't actually claim to be a Pagan.

Presumably you've now left Islam behind you, since you posted a similar
promotional message to alt.religion.islam a fortnight ago, converting to
Islam from Roman Catholicism (alt.religion.christian.roman-catholic) on
the same day. The day before that, you were posting in alt.freemansonry;
in alt.pagan the previous day ... and it goes on. Endlessly. And those
are only the religious groups; you've even leapt into uk.sport.football,
because someone was incautious enough to mention the Illuminati.

You're a serial self-publicist, with no respect for the groups you use
for your advertising billboards.

Corvus
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Carl Inglis
2004-10-27 06:18:47 UTC
Permalink
On 2004-10-26, Alert <***@postmaster.co.uk> wrote:
<snip top-posted reply>
Post by Alert
it is a philosophy, it is a way of life.
Is it part of that philosophy to ignore the mores of the culture in
which one is interacting?

If you read the FAQ, which is posted every Friday, you'd know that we
don't do top-posting in here.

<snip text replied to>

Carl

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